Comments on: Debt Generation’s first review

By: Golem XIV - Thoughts

Golem XIV - Thoughts — Tue, 16 Nov 2010 14:00:24 +0000

Ben,

That would be my Christmas present and birthday in one. But I doubt it.

By: Ben Gabel

Ben Gabel — Tue, 16 Nov 2010 13:30:06 +0000

And don't miss whistleblowerIRLs followup comment at 4:50 am!

I assume Golem we will soon get a suitably acerbic commentary on the Irish situation from you?

On another front,am I imagining it or am I am seeing phrases in mainstream comment (larry elliot &lisa o'carrol) that are very reminiscent of bits of The Debt Generation? Has someone at last got them to read a copy????

By: Golem XIV - Thoughts

Golem XIV - Thoughts — Tue, 16 Nov 2010 09:10:24 +0000

Rich,

THANKYOU! What a cracker! I asked him to consioder coming over for a visit and talking if he wished. I personally would love to hear more of the details.

Thanks again Rich.

By: RichGB

RichGB — Tue, 16 Nov 2010 08:45:42 +0000

Hi Golem

Take a look at the 4:19am comment here.

It's dynamite!

By: RichGB

RichGB — Tue, 16 Nov 2010 08:16:39 +0000

Hi JamieGriffiths

The link may have been mine, to the Irish Times.
It was in the comments for this posting.

The link to the actual article is here.

By: RichGB

RichGB — Tue, 16 Nov 2010 08:03:48 +0000

Hi DopeAddict

I think that's the second time you've dissed the Euro. Do you think the Euro is a bad idea?

By: JamieGriffiths

JamieGriffiths — Tue, 16 Nov 2010 00:12:26 +0000

I think you're right DopeAddict, about the atomisation of the Irish working class. I think there's a strong tendency there that when the going gets tough you either suck it up or emigrate.
Hence all the young people leaving in droves at the moment.
Also, I think Golem's mentioned before (or maybe it was on that World Service report that someone linked to a while back) that being seen to be struggling with debt carries a massive stigma there and so people don't admit that it's a problem. This will grow less important as everybody realises that they're in the same boat but that takes time.
I also hope they manage to pull things round and stick it to the people leeching off them but I don't think the Irish will be the first people to do so for these very reasons.

By: Dope Addict

Dope Addict — Mon, 15 Nov 2010 23:54:03 +0000

Merkel & friends will pretty much do anything to avoid a Euro zone member leaving the Euro. As things get worse & worse it will be very interesting to see how the Euro folks twist themselves into pretzel-like knots & bend over backwards to do *anything* to keep Ireland or whoever from leaving.

The first warning that someone might leave will be an election where a party runs on the platform of leaving the Euro.

Wishful thinking on my part, probably. Anyway, that's what I hope to see, because it'll be good for whoever leaves, and will be a big punch in the face to the neoliberals, though not a fatal one, unfortunately.

As for why no revolt, this disaster has developed relatively suddenly, and the bankers/neolibs acted quickly to try to save themselves. Everyone else is playing catchup.

Plus, things were going relatively well for a lot of people for a pretty long time, and I'd guess that this "lot of people" really, really want to believe that things will change for the better sooner rather than later.

It's a big step from losing your job & losing your home & losing your middle-class status to organized resistance, especially when so many recently unemployed people have been trained to be hostile to unions, so they have little experience with collective action.

Any "revolt" has got to come from the people feeling the brunt of the crisis/austerity. Fairly successful efforts have been made over the years to atomise this class of people so they feel alone, disconnected from other people. Even conceiving of banding together to resist austerity may be a big step for a lot of people. Countries with strong unions seem to be resisting the most -- France, Greece.

By: Lars Eirik

Lars Eirik — Mon, 15 Nov 2010 15:26:57 +0000

So why is Merkel suddenly the one to push a bail-out on an unwilling country, Ireland? Rather the opposite of the Greek debacle. It has been suggested to pre-empt: To demonstrate to markets how powerful an instrument the EFSF is, to take away doubts whether it can handle Portugal, Greece, Spain, Italy when their turn come (which, of course they cannot and will not)?. The Ireland situation I find especially interesting because of the 1 to 1 relation between bank bail-outs and public debt. Rather transparent and easy to understand for every citzen in Ireland. So why no revolt?

By: Golem XIV - Thoughts

Golem XIV - Thoughts — Mon, 15 Nov 2010 09:22:43 +0000

Let's hope.