What would it look like if our leaders had lost control?

What would it look like if our leaders had lost control? What would be the signs?

Here’s a list of some of the signs I think we would see.

The first sign would be that the measures our leaders had taken did not have the effect we were assured they would have. Not that they didn’t have some effect, after all you can’t subsidize banks with $16 Trillion without something happening. But if the effect is not what they assured us it would be and moreover if the underlying problem they said the actions would fix, remains unfixed, then this is to me a simple and clear proof, not even a sign, a proof, that they don’t know what they are doing. If a doctor gave you an antibiotic and said it would  clear up the infection but instead your hair fell out while the infection roared on, what would you think of the doctor and his understanding of a) medicine and b) your disease?

And if the good doctor then pushed his way back to your bed side and began shouting down all other diagnoses and insisting that you be held down and forced to swallow another, larger dose, would you swallow it? Or would you have your friends take said doctor and throw him in to the street?

Part of our problem is that the veneer of control and understanding persists long after the actual substance has gone. So Mr King comes out today defending more QE. He is a reasonable and intelligent man so there is a strong temptation to believe he must know what he’s doing. If he says we need to taker another dose of the medicine before it will finally have its advertised effect …. well he’s the doctor, right?

But the way I see it our bankers, financial experts and politicians have become like the rats, pigeons and monkeys that used to press bars for rewards in the Skinner boxes of 1950’s psychology experiments.  For those of you not familiar with the jargon of Skinner boxes and Operant Conditioning, it’s very simple. Wait until the animal does some thing you want it to do, such as peck at a button when a light comes on or press a bar, and then deliver a reward so that the animal associates the action with the reward.  Simply reward the actions you want and the animal will learn to perform the actions you desire. It was found you could train animals to do the most amazing things. 

More interesting it was found that once the animal had learnt what behaviour gave the reward it would continue to press its bar long after the reward stopped being given.  The animal had, so it was hypothesized, created a theory if it was an ‘higher’ animal, a ‘reinforced neural pathway’ if it was a  ‘lower’ one, and the behaviour became a learned habit. Once the habit was ingrained the animal would persist in it no matter what. The rat or monkey would sit there grimly pressing its bar in the apparently dogged ‘belief’ that it had worked before it would work again. The scientists found that it took a long time for, to use the jargon, the behaviour to be extinguished. 

The worst situation for the animals was what the researchers called ‘intermittent reward’. The scientists found they didn’t have to reward a behaviour every time for that behaviour to be learned and become ingrained. As long as pressing the bar would occassionally give a reward then the animals would presist in it for longer and longer periods without any reward.  They would just keep pressing it, long, long after any ‘untrained’ animal – a casual observer, would have concluded that bar pressing just didn’t work. The poor trained animals had learnt that once upon a time this was the correct action to take and now had it firmly in mind that it was still the action that gave the desired outcome, it is just you had to be determined and maintain confidence in the policy, not being blown off course by those who had lost faith. Or those who had never seen the miracle of the bar pressing in all its former glory. And so on they would go starving in their corner pressing their bar.

The ‘better’ trained the animals were at pressing their bar the longer they keep at it in the face of overwhelming objective evidence of the failure of their actions.

Seems clear to me our leaders are just pressing that bar because they don’t have the imagination to think of anything else.  They never did know why pressing the bar delivered the reward. Economics is a Skinner box, a black box, where no one can see, and certainly none of them understands, the mechanism at work. They have theories about the underlying rules and mechanisms and assumptions about human nature and the nature of economic behaviour. Their assumptions are almost all fatuous from any kind of evolutionary perspective. And their theories about the mechanisms are generally drawn from dubious first principles or based on correlations which they have noted – when this has happened in the past then this has followed. But sadly for them the correlations are very often ephemeral. They hold true for a decade or two and then seem to stop being correlated. At which point a new correlation is elevated to the status of a new rule and the old rule is quietly no longer referred to. Like some embarrassing family member everyone pretends not to have heard from in ages ands ages, if ever.  “Gosh, is he still alive. You  know I always thought there was something not right about him.”

And so they continue to press the bar and attribute anything positive that subsequently happens to their bar pressing. While anything negative is attributed to not pressing it correctly or to malign external factors. If nothing happens, well press it again a bit harder. Remeber confidence in the bar is the key to seeing the policy through!

When the proponents of pressing the bar start to disagree among themselves this, to me,  is another sign that the end is approaching. Each still believes firmly in the magic properties of the bar and of pressing it. But as they come to disagree more and more about how to press it – harder, softer, use some leverage, don’t use any leverage – and  disagree about what the results are likely to be if successfully pressed, the fact of their disagreement starts to eat away at their collective faith in the bar and its magic. This is how paradigms collapse. And I believe we are in the early stages of that collapse.

The paradigm is not making sense  even, I think, to some of the faithful.

The essence of the paradigm was that debt was not a problem because growth would take care of it. All that was required was to stimulate growth and pressing on the  ‘Bail out the banks’ bar would take care of that. They have pressed and pressed and it has not delivered. In fact debt has got worse.

In ’09 banks were would not lend to each other. We were told it was a liquidity problem. Our leaders refused point blank to even listen to any other ideas. They ignored or ridiculed those who said this was a crisis of solvency not liquidity . And ignored as outlandish and dangerous the idea that the reason banks wouldn’t lend to each other is because they all knew they had massive debts and that the assets/income stream underpinning all those debts was a lie. But the truth is the assets were not worth what the banks claimed. And because the banks all knew this to be true they quite reasonably refused to accept each others assets as collateral and without collateral they would not loan.

Fast forward over two years during which, instead of cutting out the infected tissue of bad debts, we simply fed it all to National banks and what is the result? Now we have nations who wont lend to each other. We now have a credit crunch at the sovereign level.  And it will have the same effect it had last time but larger. Now nations are starved of cash and via them whole national systems of the banks who were infected and starved of cash in 09 are at death’s door again. Only difference we, the peoples of these nations are trillions more in debt than we were three years ago.  Bravo! Bravo!

Meanwhile the monkeys in charge still won’t listen to any alternative ideas and are still at their sacred bar pressing it and telling themselves that one day soon it will work as it once did.

40 thoughts on “What would it look like if our leaders had lost control?”

  1. It does somewhat appear as though the leadership is starting to lose the argument, if not lose control of the vehicle.

    The Occupy protests are the early signs of broad based, non-violent, tricky to marginalise force of discontent from the masses. It shows signs of growing and growing.

    With yesterday’s higher than expected inflation in the UK (5.2%) then it will soon become apparent that the BoE and economists forecasts are not credible. This will just add fuel to the protests.

    Time I updated my Reinoff scale of financial instability:

    http://forensicstatistician.wordpress.com/2011/02/17/introducing-the-reinoff-scale/

    1.0 Financial liberalisation: 1997-2000
    2.0 Asset speculation: 1999-2008
    3.0 Banking crisis: 2007/8
    4.0 Currency crash: 2008/9
    5.0 Rising inflation: 2010-2011
    6.0 Sovereign Default: 2012?
    7.0 High inflation / currency collapse: 2013?

    In February I pitched it at 5.1. Now I think I will offically upgrade the UK to 5.3 on the Reinoff scale. This means that inflation is likely to pick up, and some form of sovereign default (which can take the form of modest currency devaluation by the way) is still highly likely to occur in 2012.

    Once we tip over a Reinoff scale of 6.0 and head higher towards 7.0, then they really will have lost control.

  2. Nail on the head David – If memory serve’s (and often it doesn’t) what was given less provenance in Skinner’s findings was, when more than one rat was in the box and the intermittent reward was in operation they fought like rats in the ‘belief’ – if such a condition is applicable to rat’s? – that only they were the one that could gain the reward.

    But in the world of rats that may have been an unfair assumption – one only applicable to the two legged variety,

  3. Has the politicos ever really been “in control” of the economy?

    The problem(s) arise from the academy, the view that economics is some sort of machine, just like the Bankers shifted the risk to others, academics have shifted the risk to others too by excluding other views and approaches to the field.

    I am not making any point about neo classical views and theories one way or another, but just as capital needs competition so do ideas. It seems the bankers were not the only ones running a monopoly. As said before there seems to be some deep seated problems in the social “science” depts.

    Its a very interesting but dangerous book Khun’s The Structure of Scientific Revolutions. the paradigm is always relative, and as such never progressive in any meaningful way. This pretty much explains the thinking of the politicos

    I think economics is more akin to gardening than physics, the creative destruction that I have brought to bear on my summer plants will clear the way a new healthy crop next summer, so too changing the soil. It seems to be there can be no growth until the debt contaminated soil has been purged and dug out.

    Bankruptcy is very much the capitalist way, purge the debt, reconstitute the company and move on.

    But there is another problem the one of democracy. Which is much more than a x in the box. We have moved from the common law and juries to the technocratic roman system off top down law making, this of course benefits the technocrats as well as the multinationals. We need to the restore the jury to civil proceedings and make the system of law open enough for groups of people to bring their cases before the courts, and let the trial and error system of evolving common law re-emerge from its slumber. Fred the Shred and Gordon Brown might have thought a little more carefully about their choices if this system was in place

    Making political manifestos legally binding might help too.

    Thank goodness for the jury, another great import by those pesky Anglo- Saxons :0)

    1. I agree with so much you have written here Sean especially with regard to the Social Sciences. I personally think academia is as much to blame for this mess as the politicians. Economic dissent has been stifled ever since Thatcher declared TINA – there is no alternative to the free market. There is and always was an alternative but that alternative didn’t suit those with money and power. Our universities have been complicit in this belief. Any flaws in the free market system were ignored or swept under the carpet. To dissent was seen as out of touch. What’s more as debate has been closed for so long the powers that be are totally unable to see, much less understand, a way out of this mess. For them there is only their beloved ‘free market’. They have brainwashed themselves.

      1. But, was Thatcher misunderstood/misinterpreted?
        Would Thatcher, if in power now, by-pass the banks altogether and promulgate a free ‘exchange of goods’ free market ? Money being exchanged personally and some (not much, duh) ‘profit’ being made.
        Is this what she really was aiming for?
        Academics, we luv them and god bless them…. but their salaries are from the State’s ability to deal in world financial markets. Academia are just people who also need to live; so they sure ‘aint going to topple the golden hen.
        Boycott the Banks?

  4. There is a weakness in this argument though. So the stimulus in the US got through but it was too weak to have any long term effect, those advocating the stimulus said so before hand (Paul Krugman, Dean Baker etc.) but when the stimulus petered out they demanded more spending. The GOP used this stimulus as evidence that the lack of demand hypothesis is wrong, since we tried stimulus and it didn’t work.

    I think in a complex world where one does not get the time to investigate and learn all the knowledge one can get you should rely on those experts who have tended to be correct in the past and assume they will continue to be correct. In the current crisis I’ve been reading Paul Krugman and Dean Baker, especially the latter as they’ve been correct about everything for a very long time.

    They are using a model of the economy that has a theory of LS=LM in situations like this, when interest rates are stuck at a ‘zero lower bound’. The theory predicts that in situations like this huge increases in the monetary base will not lead to inflation as future expectations of recovery are so poor. This has been true in the US and I think in the UK the spike in inflation is due to energy costs and nothing more.

  5. @Dush

    If you haven’t already done so, I would recommend you take a look at the “billy blog” – the model you describe seems to be in harmony with Modern Monetary Theory MMT expounded eloquently by Bill Mitchell and others. Bill’s primer on deficits and how they do not necessarily invoke inflation is very good and is here: http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=332

    @Golem

    I believe the politicos never had a grip on or an understanding of this and hence have never been “in control”.

    1. You should read some economic history and forget your models. Every paper money system has eventually led to runaway deficits and an inflationary collapse. Always, 100%.

        1. Dush

          It would seem that certainly since the 1970s there has been (internationally at least) no alternative but fiat currency regimes.

          The important thing is not so much what each individual country may do, but what the international anchor of trade, the world currency is based upon. At the moment we have the US fiat dollar regime.

          I don’t subscribe to the Austrian school (I’m leaning more towards being a Post-Keynesian), but this history of world reserve currency status is very good:

          http://mises.org/daily/4728/The-Monetary-Breakdown-of-the-West

          The very bedrock international commerce (fluctuating fiat currencies) is breaking down at the moment.

          The dollar and all proxy currencies (for which the pound, yen, Euro, Yuan and everything else really is, just a proxy for the dollar) have become vastly separated from the real underlying representation of wealth.

          This is no ordinary business cycle recession but the rumbling fractures of a world trade system ready to blow apart at any moment.

      1. The hard money systems break down 100% as well, and mostly for the same reasons that fiat money systems break down.

    2. Thanks Ian, going to read it now.

      I used to be very sceptical of economic models and how the entire profession has physics envy where they try and match the mathematical method of that subject that studies the most simple things in the universe. That simply doesn’t work with complex humans on the scale of trillions of interactions daily.

      But some of these toy models work with predicting what’s going to happen. So we shouldn’t discount all of economics because there are some morons out there that don’t adjust their models to the data. We should look at those honest economics that are trying to make sense of the world.

  6. Dush
    Steve Keen does not have a lot of time for Paul Krugman, who still relies on the flawed assumptions underpinning neo-classical economics, which I’m reading about in his latest version of Debunking Economics. Unlike Krugman, Keen predicted the crisis many years in advance. The lack of demand is due to excessive private debt. Austerity and inflation in the price of goods is making this worse.

    1. Not heard of Steve Keen, I’ll take a look at his work. Did he predict the housing bubble with a quantative paper as Dean Baker did? I’ve read alot about lots of economists that predicted this mess, and all they seem to have said is that something bad is going to happen in the future because of debt. They weren’t specific. I mean after the deregulation with FrankDodd anyone could have predicted it would lead to a big mess but that’s not really useful.

      Baker’s paper is at: http://www.cepr.net/index.php/publications/reports/the-run-up-in-home-prices-is-it-real-or-is-it-another-bubble/

      Also Krugman is a Keynesian not neo-classicist.

      1. Dush

        Yes, Keen did indeed predict the crash, and he is listed as one of the 12 economists “who saw it coming”, along with Dean Baker:

        http://mpra.ub.uni-muenchen.de/15892/1/MPRA_paper_15892.pdf

        In summary that paper from Bezemer shows how it is the role of debt and accountling flows between finance and the real economy which underpinned all the models of those who did predict the crash.

        P.S. Krugman is a “populist Keynesian”, which means he probably hasn’t actually read Keynes, but relied on the likes of Hicks to interpret him (or as Keen would say “mis-interpret” Keynes) in order to achieve the so-called neo-classical “synthesis” (i.e. making sure that Keynes’ heretical stance could somehow be taken within mainstream without undermining it). If he still believes in equilibrium models then Krugman is really a neo-classicist.

        Keen is a Post-Keynesian, and that school of thought stemmed from Minsky as a much purer interpretation of Keynes (plus with Fisher Debt Deflation thrown in too). This school rejects equilibrium theory and states that a period of financial stability creates conditions for instability.

        1. Oooo thanks for the link. There isn’t enough time in the day to read all these papers dammit!

          Krugman has read Keynes, I know that from reading his blog for the past 3 years. He’s always posting about how people need to go back to see what Keynes wrote and not the interpretations further along.

          I got an A-Level in Economics in 2003 so some of those schools ring bells but I’m not sure exactly where to place Krugman. All I know is he’s been bang on in his predictions since we got into this mess. What I really like about him is that he’s a serious ‘scientist’. He makes predictions, if they’re wrong he’ll reconsider. e.g. todays post on our inflation numbers makes a prediction for end of the year: http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/10/19/money-and-inflation-british-edition/

          1. Dush

            You are quite right to judge economists by their predictions!

            I’m not as convinced that inflation will recede. Krugman doesn’t appear to have read Reinhart & Rogoff – see the first comment on this post.

            I’ll stick my neck out now, and then in a few years time you can compare me with Krugman!

            I’m predicting “Hyperstagbiflation”!

            This is because we are likely to get a mixture of Stagflation (so economic stagnation as in slow or declining GDP growth with high unemployment and high inflation), but with currency trashing (the Hyper bit) and Biflation (where there’s a rise in the price of commodity/earnings-based assets and a simultaneous fall in the price of debt-based assets – deflation).

            How I arrive at this is two fold. First because of the world reserve currency point I made on earlier post (this crisis is not an exogenous shock to a normally stable economic equilibrium as their models assume), and secondly because the likes of Krugman (and other mainstream economists) don’t understand where economic growth actually comes from. I hope to write a proper post on this at some point soon, but a sneak peak at the answer is here:

            http://forensicstatistician.wordpress.com/2011/05/27/is-economics-a-real-science/

      2. Dush: “deregulation with DoddFrank”.

        I think you mean the dismantling of Glass-Steagall, which was brought in after the Wall Street Crash of 1929. Ironically, this began under Clinton, though it was extended under Bush.

        Dodd-Frank, on the other hand, was brought in to reform financial regulation after the 2008 crisis.

  7. richard in norway

    Has anyone seen the OWS draft document, Karl has it up on market ticker. It’s dynamite, here is the first bit

    WHEREAS THE FIRST AMENDMENT TO THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION PROVIDES:

    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

    BE IT RESOLVED THAT:

    WE, THE NINETY-NINE PERCENT OF THE PEOPLE of the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, in order to form a more perfect Union, by, for and of the PEOPLE, shall elect and convene a NATIONAL GENERAL ASSEMBLY beginning on July 4, 2012 in the City Of Philadelphia.

    I. Election of Delegates:

    The People, consisting of all United States citizens who have reached the age of 18, regardless of party affiliation and voter registration status, shall elect Two Delegates, one male and one female, by direct vote, from each of the existing 435 Congressional Districts to represent the People at the NATIONAL GENERAL ASSEMBLY in Philadelphia. Said Assembly shall convene on July 4, 2012 in the city of Philadelphia.

    The office of Delegate shall be open to all United States citizens who have reached the age of 18. Election Committees, elected by local General Assemblies from all over the United States, shall coordinate with the 99 Percent Declaration Working Group (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/the99declaration/) to organize, coordinate and fund this national election by direct democratic voting. The Election Committees shall operate similarly to the original Committees of Correspondence during the first American Revolution.

    II. Meeting of the National General Assembly and Deliberation:

    At the NATIONAL GENERAL ASSEMBLY, the 870 Delegates shall set forth, consider and vote upon a PETITION OF GRIEVANCES to be submitted to all members of Congress, The Supreme Court and President and each of the political candidates running in the nationwide Congressional and Presidential election in November 2012. The Delegates of the National General Assembly shall vote upon and implement their own agenda, propagate their own rules and elect or appoint committee members as the Delegates see fit to accomplish their goal of presenting a PETITION OF GRIEVANCES from the 99% of Americans before the 2012 elections.

    I don’t know how for they will get but they ain’t being modest.

  8. Richard & Neil, thanks for posting. I’ve joined & sent info on 2nd-republic.ie – hope they find that helpful, I was hoping they’d choose this route, right way to get the change we need imo, excellent!

    Golem

    “…rats grimly pressing the bar….”

    Says it all, just brilliant mate, grinning as I type 🙂

    1. richard in norway

      Be careful not to swamp them, it must be very exhausting for them to have the hopes of a large part of the globe resting upon their shoulders

  9. I’ve been reading 1918 The Last Act, about the final year of the First World War and the parallels are sobering…but one cant help but think that at least European fudge and indecision among its craven leaders is better than that. Its still just austerity and cuts they are firing at everyone not high explosive and machine gun bullets…

    But its also a reminder that people in power who themselves are safe and comfortable will continue on with policies that kill and main others to the bitter end. There will be no mercy, no rethinking of what is all for. Only fear of a violent backlash ( revolution) will stop the process.

  10. The monkeys in charge have been very well fed by continuing to press the lever. It’s the rest of us that are starving.

    1. Unfortunately, the report rather pulls its punches in an effort to maintain ‘objectivity’, arguing without any real conviction that we may need global anti-trust rules, but it does highlight how oligopoly happens as a natural consequence of the workings of the market, rather than through outright conspiracy

      “It’s disconcerting to see how connected things really are,” agrees George Sugihara of the Scripps Institution of Oceanography in La Jolla, California, a complex systems expert who has advised Deutsche Bank.

      Crucially, by identifying the architecture of global economic power, the analysis could help make it more stable. By finding the vulnerable aspects of the system, economists can suggest measures to prevent future collapses spreading through the entire economy. Glattfelder says we may need global anti-trust rules, which now exist only at national level, to limit over-connection among TNCs.
      Bar-Yam says the analysis suggests one possible solution: firms should be taxed for excess interconnectivity to discourage this risk.

      One thing won’t chime with some of the protesters’ claims: the super-entity is unlikely to be the intentional result of a conspiracy to rule the world.

      “Such structures are common in nature,” says Sugihara.
      Newcomers to any network connect preferentially to highly connected members. TNCs buy shares in each other for business reasons, not for world domination. If connectedness clusters, so does wealth, says Dan Braha of NECSI: in similar models, money flows towards the most highly connected members.

      The Zurich study, says Sugihara, “is strong evidence that simple rules governing TNCs give rise spontaneously to highly connected groups”. Or as Braha puts it: “The Occupy Wall Street claim that 1 per cent of people have most of the wealth reflects a logical phase of the self-organising economy.”

      So, the super-entity may not result from conspiracy. The real question, says the Zurich team, is whether it can exert concerted political power. Driffill feels 147 is too many to sustain collusion. Braha suspects they will compete in the market but act together on common interests. Resisting changes to the network structure may be one such common interest.”

      This is the point made by Dan Alpert (managing partner of the New York investment bank Westwood Capital): ”Alpert doesn’t believe there was a capitalist conspiracy; his point is that had there been a conspiracy, the outcome wouldn’t look much different.” He sees it as the inevitable result of the formation of “the post-Glass-Steagall mega-monstrosities.” http://goo.gl/KU59b

      This concentration of wealth and power is the inexorable result of market forces, which is why the wealthy and powerful seek to restrict intervention by government. Their greatest success has been to convince enough of the rest of us that this trend is in our interest through the promotion of a neoliberal ideology shot through with contradictions. Hence the explosion of blogs that operate as anti-government rantathons, by a rag-bag of right-wing libertarians, left-wing libertarians, and gold-bugs, which help to perpetuate rather than challenge that ideology. As a result we have the absurdity of people who, for three decades, have been calling for deregulation and small government, asking where the political leadership is, and why governments don’t seem to have any control over the economy!

      Paradoxically, competitive ‘free markets’ have to be enforced – a lesson we had to learn the hard way in the last century through the development of anti-trust/monopoly legislation and the regulation of banking and capital through Glass-Steagall, Bretton-Woods, etc. It’s just a pity that we seem to doomed to go through the whole process again.

  11. Academics sold out with all the alacrity of a house of cards. The old collegiality was responsible for what quality there was and was swept away under kwality regimes and business applicability. The Skinner Box isn’t a bad metaphor. Mature students often asked me whether I thought they could use the techniques I taught as telling the truth at work was to issue a job suicide note. I was never an adherent of love-trust organisation development
    My usual explanations of the current situation is that the theories-in-use are counterfactual, ignoring what is core as ephemeral – vast riches to a small few etc. If anyone wants to be really appalled take a look at HRM since 1995. This makes Skinner look enlightened in Walden 2 – possibly the most boring novel ever written in its prose, but not too bad in terms of trying a different social tack.
    There are some decent theories on leadership, but in the main clown rot is taught that justifies autocracy and flagrant selfishness. Pluralism is to be destroyed in these models.

    We might say the current situation is that of Voltaire’s ‘Candide’.

  12. Superb idea for a blog article!

    They never had control, though, so not surprizing that your conclusion and route to it is so obvious?

    They always have pretended to have the ability to make jobs, dispense dole and arrange circuses. They will damage the support apparatus for this con trick if they actually take effective control and really create jobs….. So there are many forces, FORCES, ranged against them. Now they are organizing to dismantle those forces, or the most dangerous ones, so they can invest in infrastructure projects. If they do not, and they know this better than you, they face total loss of illusion and their friendly forces will dispose of them if they do that….

    this is internecine war, where TPTB prune the dead wood! Expect more of the DSK/ Liam Fox/NOTW business as they grapple to turn the wheel of the ship of state while looking for greater international integration!

    Fascinating insights are available if you get the ear of an insider? Try ringing around, a civil servant may spill some of the beans?

  13. The animal analogy is a good one because the more MK appears in public the more he looks like a rabbit caught in headlights.

  14. Sorry I am a just a guest at your blog arriving via a twisted path starting from the last days of Friedrich Nieztsche via the masters of psychoanalysis to a dimmed link towards Dangerous Knowledge leading me hereto within a few clicks… i have not even a slightest idea of the “economic” or “financial” matter and APOLOGISE in advance for dropping a somewhat irrelevant note, BUT i am intuitively fascinated by the sparkling discussions revealed here, and like all that absolute majority of simple mortals, quiet victims of experiments, i wish to hope that such guys as you, the smart ARISTOCRATES OF THOUGHT, could transmit your ideas to a wider public and indeed plant the seed of CHANGE to save the sinking ship we are all drifting in…i just do my bit in never using a credit card, but without that i cannot even purchase the book on your website, so debt is ultimately inevitable even here 🙂

  15. @ Guest

    Golem usually welcomes new commenters here, but he’s at a speaking engagement in Dublin tonight & is probably ‘off-line’, so I’ll step in. Welcome & thanks for the kind words!

    The Occupy Wall Street movement has just started a forum to figure out what they plan to do going forward. A very encouraging effort by them & all their worldwide affiliate movements. I’ve just posted up on their forum & thrown in my 2ct with link to our esteemed blogger Golem here. My post there:

    http://the99delegation.forumotion.com/t7-what-is-our-mission#1006

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